New York Times bestselling author Jen Hatmaker and her longtime friend, Amy Hardin, have arrived in the middle years — and they couldn’t be happier about it.
E...
Bethany Joy Lenz: Breaking Free, Finding Faith, and Dinner for Vampires
This week Jen and Amy sit down with actress, musician, and author Bethany Joy Lenz to discuss her deeply personal memoir, Dinner for Vampires: Life on a Cult TV Show (While also in an Actual Cult!). Bethany opens up about her experience in a high-control group, known as “The Big House Family” religious cult, the complexities of spiritual abuse, and how she found her way back to faith and autonomy with the help of a One Tree Hill fan. They explore themes of manipulation, resilience, and the power of telling your story.
This raw and inspiring conversation offers hope, clarity, and empowerment for anyone navigating their own path to freedom.
Jen and Amy “Rant or Rave” about New Year’s resolutions and Amy teaches us some creative perspectives to take to feel more successful in this space.
And we reminisce about our favorite shows from the early 2000s. West Wing… the best! Criminal Minds, 24, Gray’s Anatomy, all bingeable. Gilmore Girls, c’mon. And what about One Tree Hill?
***
Thought-provoking Quotes:
It doesn’t feel like a courageous act. It’s survival. Courage is when you are fully aware of the dangers that lie ahead – like a fireman, willing to run into a burning building to grab a baby – that’s courage because you know what’s at stake. When you are already in the burning building trying to find your way out, it doesn’t take courage, it’s survival – “find me the exit, how do I get out?” – Bethany Joy Lenz
My faith has evolved into something that is much more connected to my gut which feels much more authentic. I feel a lot more comfortable asking questions and I really value doubt. The truth rises to the top. I think God is capable of communicating with all of us when it’s the right time in the right way. If the gospel shows us anything, it's that God meets us where we are. – Bethany Joy Lenz
I think a lot of Christians live in a space where we think it's very noble to not question God, like we think he’ll love us more, appreciate us more, we’ll be better disciples or believers. But he gave us the brains that we have for a reason. Is he capable of satisfying our intellect or not? So, push the button as hard and as far down as you can. It’ll hold. – Bethany Joy Lenz
God is big enough to hold all of you. There’s nothing that you can present to God that is going to scare him off. He can handle the worst version of you, the angry version of you, the confused version of you. You don’t need other people to hold you. The Bible is full of stories of God one-on-one with someone (Job, Moses, Jesus) so you don’t need to be afraid of being alone with the Lord. – Bethany Joy Lenz
Resources Mentioned in This Episode:
Paul Teal - https://www.imdb.com/name/nm3806295/
Joy’s tribute to Paul Teal - https://www.instagram.com/reel/DCf3CtopQt1/
Dinner for Vampires: Life on a Cult TV Show (While also in an Actual Cult!) - https://www.amazon.com/Dinner-Vampires-Life-While-Actual/dp/1668067307
Drama Queens Podcast - https://open.spotify.com/show/344eFGlcjmdAUqvWzPJzBk
Tim Keller sermon on Doubt - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/praying-our-doubts/id352660924?i=1000678149013
Modern Vintage News - https://www.modernvintagenews.com/
Guest’s Links:
Joy’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/msbethanyjoylenz/
Joy’s Twitter - https://x.com/itsjoylenz
Joy’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/BethanyJoyLenz/
Joy’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@msbethanyjoylenz
Connect with Jen!
Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/
Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker
Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/
Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker
Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker
The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.
To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices
--------
1:15:02
Cozy Love Stories and Second Chances: A Conversation with Josie Silver
Description:
In this delightful episode, Jen Hatmaker sits down with bestselling author Josie Silver, the brilliant mind behind One Day in December. Josie shares her journey from writing ten novels to achieving massive success with this enchanting Christmas love story. Together, Jen and Josie discuss the creative process, the inspiration behind her characters, and the challenges of crafting a love story that spans a decade.
Josie opens up about the unexpected ways her personal life influences her writing, how she brings authenticity to her characters, and what it feels like to finally hit her stride after years of writing. Whether you're a die-hard romance fan or simply looking for your next great read, this cozy conversation will inspire and entertain.
Thought-provoking Quotes:
You write the men you want them to be, not necessarily the men they are. That’s part of the magic of romance writing.” – Josie Silver
“I think a lot of the little, quiet moments in life—the shorthand between people who truly know each other—are what make stories feel real.” – Josie Silver
“Do you want help, or do you want a hug?” – Jen Hatmaker, reflecting on parenting young adults.
It was a joy to write this book. Some books come out more easily than others and, this one, I wrote in six weeks. Some books have taken six months, some have taken far longer; whereas this one, every time I sat down, everything just seemed to work. – Josie Silver
Resources Mentioned in This Episode:
One Day in December: A Novel by Josie Silver - https://amzn.to/3OD2D9A
Guest’s Links:
Josie’s books - https://amzn.to/3VlTFl3
Josie’s website - https://josiesilver.com/
Josie’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/josiesilverauthor
Josie’s Twitter - https://x.com/josiesilver
Josie’s BlueSky - https://bsky.app/profile/josiesilver.bsky.social
Josie’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/JosieSilverAuthor
Connect with Jen!
Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/
Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker
Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/
Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker
Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker
The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.
To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices
--------
42:06
Hope Breaks Through the Hard Stuff: Rev. Dr. Angela N. Parker on Advent
Settle in, listeners. Jen and Amy have invited Greek and New Testament professor and scholar, Reverend Dr. Angela N. Parker to the show to reflect on the Advent season with some words of hope and liberation. She took our butts to seminary, opening our eyes to what it looks like when you examine the scripture through the lens of womanist theology and the experiences of Black women. But as Dr. Parker tells us, “I’ve lived long enough to know that God will bring me through but sometimes it’s hard and sometimes it hurts. But even after the hurt, the tender spots get more resilient.”
There’s so much to unpack in this one.
Jen and Amy discuss their favorite Christmas movies and debate whether classics like Gremlins and Die Hard fit the genre
Dr. Parker explains how liberation is a collective journey, not an individual one – and how everyone, including white men, can need it.
We learn how understanding the historical context of scripture is vital for its interpretation.
And we also talk about some of the holiday hullabaloo we’re ready to Bless and Release this season.
***
Thought-provoking Quotes:
“If I’m liberated, I don’t want to be liberated alone.” – Dr. Angela N. Parker
“We don’t want to think about the early church being enslavers.” – Dr. Angela N. Parker
“If our biblical text is wrestling with the idea of empire from Genesis to Revelation, we are wrestling with empire as well.” –– Dr. Angela N. Parker
“When we work as a collective, we actually do better to transform society.” – Dr. Angela N. Parker
“The tree at the end of Revelation 21 has the leaves for the healing of all the “Ethnae”, for all the ethnicities, for all the nations. That’s what John the Revelator sees in his final vision.” – Dr. Angela N. Parker
“In my own work, I talk about how I try to even get whiteness out of me. Even as an African American woman born and raised in these United States, there are elements of whiteness that are in me, on me and a part of me. That’s just what we swim in.” – Dr. Angela N. Parker
“Hope breaks forth in the midst of terror, fear, and overwhelm. It’s normal to have [those feelings]. Don’t trick yourself into ignoring them. It’s best for us to acknowledge what is going on around us but to remember that hope breaks through.” – Dr. Angela N. Parker
“I’ve lived long enough to know that God will bring me through but sometimes it’s still hard and sometimes it still hurts. But even after the hurt, the tender spots get more resilient.” – Dr. Angela N. Parker
Resources Mentioned in This Episode:
Orange Theory - https://www.orangetheory.com/en-us
James Hal Cone - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_H._Cone
Jacquelyn Grant - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacquelyn_Grant
Delores Williams - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delores_S._Williams
Katie Cannon - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katie_Cannon
Alice Walker - https://alicewalkersgarden.com/
Rev. Dr. Margaret Aymer - https://www.austinseminary.edu/cf_directory/dirprofile.cfm?p=2576&id=4459
Sisters in the Wilderness: The Challenge of Womanist God by Delores Williams - https://amzn.to/4eV3Nce
If God Still Breathes, Why Can't I?: Black Lives Matter and Biblical Authority by Rev. Dr. Angela N. Parker - https://amzn.to/3YkO9Qo
Guest’s Links:
Angela’s website - https://theology.mercer.edu/faculty-and-staff/parker/
Angela’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/boozybiblescholar/
Angela’s Twitter - https://x.com/BzyBibleScholar
Angela’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/WomanistNTScholar/
Angela’s TikTok - https://www.tiktok.com/@boozybiblescholar
Connect with Jen!
Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/
Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker
Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/
Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker
Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker
The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.
To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices
--------
1:07:59
Reinventing Yourself with Heather Land
This week Jen introduces Amy and the For the Love audience to her long-time friend, comedian Heather Land, who gained fame as a social media sensation through her viral I Ain’t Doin’ It videos. They discuss Heather’s journey from an early career in ministry to one in comedy, and now to her newest passion project, life coaching. Heather talks to Jen and Amy about the impact of burnout and the challenges of reinventing oneself, especially at different life stages and finding joy in her new creative project, the Dear Heathers podcast (that she co-hosts with best-friend Heather Lenard) encouraging other women to embrace their journeys and feel empowered.
In this episode:
Jen and Amy share their mixed feelings on receiving unsolicited advice.
Inspired by the Dear Heathers podcast, Amy and Jen reminisce about what it was like using landline phones when they were teens. Shocker: Jen even remembers her old phone number!
The group talks about the importance of recognizing signs of burnout and how reinventing oneself is a vital part of personal growth
Heather shares how support from friends can play a crucial role in our journey, like when her friend advised her to ‘do it [comedy] afraid’.
Jen, Amy, and Heather talk about women looking to others with relatable stories when they go through difficult experiences and how community can be our greatest lifeline.
***
Thought-provoking Quotes:
“What do I have to lose except my dignity?” – Heather Land
“Standup is maybe the hardest form of comedy. It’s not scripted. You don’t have directors and writers. It is a hot seat and it’s live. It’s sink or swim. You picked the hardest way to be funny.” – Jen Hatmaker
“You are in full integrity when you make a change when something is still working. That is a move that is in full alignment which is something to be proud of.” – Jen Hatmaker
“We ask kids ‘what do you want to be when you grow up?” and I don’t think we leave a lot of room for ‘What do I want to be next?’ or ‘what do I want to be when I’m 40, or 50, or 60?’.” – Heather Land
“I’m sorry, I have not hired you as my life coach.” – Amy Hardin
Resources Mentioned in This Episode:
Heather’s I Ain’t Doin’ It Playlist - https://youtu.be/slcwYADYwRc?si=Oe-m-0jf3-wDdVmH
Dear Heathers Podcast - https://www.heatherlandofficial.com/podcast
Heather Lenard - https://www.heatherlenard.com/
Life Coaching with Heather Land - https://www.heatherlandofficial.com/life-coach#book-an-appointment
Nichole Nordeman - https://www.instagram.com/nicholenordeman/
Susannah Lewis (Whoa Susannah) - https://whoasusannah.com/
Jen Hatmaker Book Club Cruise January 30-February 3, 2025 - https://shop.jenhatmaker.com/pages/cruise
Only Murders in the Building - https://www.hulu.com/series/only-murders-in-the-building
Should men take baths? - Dear Heathers: Ep. 3 Bath Time with the Swon Brothers - https://apple.co/4eI6s9b
Guest’s Links:
Heathers’s website - https://www.heatherlandofficial.com/
Heather’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/heatherland_iaintdoinit
Heather’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/iaintdoinit/
Heather’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCs4omp2klYLTOqqY56j-8Ag
Dear Heathers Podcast - https://www.heatherlandofficial.com/podcast
Connect with Jen!
Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/
Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker
Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/
Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker
Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker
The SupportBeltTM is designed and validated for Ford and Lincoln vehicle specifications and is intended only for use in those vehicles; Ford is making the design available via license for other automakers to manufacture and test in their vehicles. For shoulder belt use only. Do not use on lap portion of belt. Not for use by children or with child seats or booster seats. For use by mastectomy patients.
The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.
To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices
--------
1:10:51
Krista Tippett: Making Spiritual Conversations Relatable and Real
Krista Tippett's work in the realm of spirituality and human experience is unparalleled. She just has a divine gift for distilling complex topics into clear, palatable information that we can sit with, dissect, and examine. She uses her OnBeing podcast as a place to conduct honest conversations with theologians and thought leaders about what it means to be human, what it means to be alive. Curiosity is welcome in her space. She brings a sense of calm to everything around her. So during the frenzy of the holidays, which can be both joyful and stressful, we wanted to circle back to this centering conversation with Krista to decompress and be at peace with the world. This conversation feels like an oasis in what is always a chaotic month so it’s our gift to bring it back for you this week.
Segments:
Bless and Release: Rules for holiday decorating and making the holidays magical
GenXcellence: Essentials for outfitting a GenX space
***
Thought-provoking Quotes:
If a thing is feeling stressful and not joyful, it needs to be re-evaluated. – Jen Hatmaker
I actually found in the Bible, reading it for myself directly, that it completely honored the questions, and it honored the anguish, and it was full of things that didn’t make sense or were contradictory. And for me that was an opening to not feel that faith had to be in opposition to what didn’t make sense or was contradictory. – Krista Tippett
There has to be a way to represent the complexity of this, and also the centrality of it, the fact that it’s more about questions than it is about answers, and the array of how we walk around with this, and what it means in our lives, and the ways we practice, and the vocabulary we have, and the different ways we pray. I wanted to show that you could talk about this and we could speak about the part of ourselves that we mean when we use language of religious or spiritual. – Krista Tippett
The sensibility, the intentionality with which something is offered, shapes the reaction that comes at it. – Krista Tippett
I do have a spiritual homeland and I do have a spiritual mother tongue. That matters. – Krista Tippett
Resources Mentioned in This Episode:
Walter Brueggeman – https://www.walterbrueggemann.com/
The Prophetic Imagination – https://onbeing.org/programs/walter-brueggemann-the-prophetic-imagination-dec2018/
Thích Nhât Hanh – https://plumvillage.org/
Desmond Tutu – https://www.tutu.org.za/
Mary Oliver – https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poets/mary-oliver
I Got Saved By the Beauty of the World – https://onbeing.org/programs/mary-oliver-i-got-saved-by-the-beauty-of-the-world/
Guest’s Links:
OnBeing Podcast - https://onbeing.org/series/podcast/
Krista’s website - https://onbeing.org/our-story/krista-tippett/
Krista’s Twitter - https://x.com/kristatippett
Connect with Jen!
Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/
Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker
Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/
Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker
Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker
The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.
To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices
New York Times bestselling author Jen Hatmaker and her longtime friend, Amy Hardin, have arrived in the middle years — and they couldn’t be happier about it.
Each has navigated the ins and outs of life — from careers, to parenting, marriage (and, for Jen, divorce), spiritual evolution, and the joys of being hardcore Gen Xers.
With each weekly episode, Jen and Amy serve as our “everywoman” guides to all the seasons — past, present, and future — as they walk excitedly and tenaciously into the second half of life.
While Jen and Amy have plenty of wisdom to share — and some pretty hilarious stories, too — they don’t claim to know it all. That's why they invite some of the most interesting and accomplished guests to the podcast, bringing insight, expertise, and understanding to the most relevant topics of our time. From Jen and Amy’s compelling conversations with guests to their witty banter (and the occasional eye-rolls at the absurdities of life), they’re here reassure you that you’re not alone in this game of life.
It’s “For the Love” of all that is good, justified, exasperating, exhilarating, real, fun — and so much more.
Listen to For The Love With Jen Hatmaker Podcast, Hysterical and many other podcasts from around the world with the radio.net app