Ask the A&Ps

• "They put all their maintenance records on napkins"

  Chris is trying to make sense of his logbooks. He has a Cessna 172 RG and he and his partners had a few electrical issues recently. Some of the logbook entries went in the airframe book and some went in the engine logbook, and he’s wondering about the decision-making process involved in picking the proper logbook. Mike said there’s no requirements around which entry to put in which logbook, and in fact, there’s no requirement to have a logbook in the first place. It’s easier and retains the value of the aircraft, of course, but the need to keep a specific logbook isn’t based on regulation. The reason we use different logbooks, he said, is because if we were ever to sell the engine separately from the airplane, it would be nice to be able to include the record in the sale. If the item would move with the engine, put it in the engine logbook. Paul said his shop only puts the annual inspection in one logbook, and typically that’s in the airframe book. Brandon has a 1977 Cessna 182Q with a low-time engine. Every time he borescopes it he sees lots of lead buildup on the valve stems of the cooler cylinders. He’s wondering if there’s a way to run it hotter, or is there something he can add to the fuel. The hosts agree that it’s actually a mixture distribution issue, something normal and expected in the O-470. Paul had a 182 and he did a bunch of lean testing. When he would lean to roughness and roll it back only enough to smooth out the engine, he would have two cylinders lean of peak, two at peak, and two rich of peak. Mike suggests adding TCP to the fuel. The main downside is that it’s quite toxic, so careful handling is required. Scott is interested in pushing the boundaries of the maintenance regulations. He’s wondering if he is allowed to sign off an AD as an owner because the regs don’t specifically state it has to be a mechanic. Mike thinks it must be an A&P because they are inspections, and only A&Ps can do inspections. There are a few ADs that explicitly allow the owner/operator to perform them. Paul suggests that a lot of ADs require a maintenance action that is outside the scope of owner-performed maintenance as well. Mike is questioning Continental’s guidance that limits extended running below 2,300 rpm. He finds that his airplane runs smoothest at 2,100 rpm. Mike explains that the bulletin came about after an issue with Cape Air and their 402s. After a few in-flight engine failures, they grounded the fleet and started inspecting engines. The failures were caused by counterweight release with accelerated wear in the pins and bushings. Continental couldn’t find anything wrong with the parts, and they guessed that it was due to operation at low rpm. Cape Air was operating at high power, rich of peak. They never tracked down the real problem, and guessed this was the issue. Cape Air had gone from operating at 2,300 rpm to 2,200 rpm. Mike believes that if you are operating at high power and rich of peak, it might be worth observing the limit, but if you are operating at low power, or lean of peak, you can ignore it.

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  1:02:17
• "Keep torturing those airplanes...and students"

  John is a maintenance officer in a club, and he is wondering about tire ply ratings. The manual calls for 4 ply, but they often install 6 ply and he’s wondering if that’s ok. The hosts all agree that they have subbed in higher ply ratings when supply dictates. Paul’s rule of thumb is that he always allows a higher ply, but not lower. That’s because the ply rating relates to the weight of the aircraft. Heavier aircraft need higher ply ratings. They get into a discussion on retreads, which can cause issues. They like retreads, but caution that you must ensure they will fit in the wheel well on a retract. Paul worked on a 210 once that caught the skins when retracted.   Doug instructs in Aerostars, and he has worked with a number of clients lately who want him to omit the engine-out portion of the training in order to avoid stress on the engines. There’s talk in the Aerostar community about heavy and light cases. Mike said not to worry about the case. Rather, cylinders that rapidly cool are the concern and that’s because the piston and cylinder are different metal densities and cool at different rates, which can lead to scuffing. They all agree the training is important, but pulling the power back slowly, rather than cutting the fuel, will help reduce the risk of engine damage. Paul makes the point that flight schools do this in Seminoles all day, and that he doesn’t hear of widespread issues. Failure isn’t a concern, Mike said. Scuffing is a wear issue. If it’s an issue, Paul said his pistons probably look terrible, but he’s not going to worry about it. He already borescopes regularly. And Mike said he will run an aux tank dry on a long flight.   Jason has a Comanche 250 with some electrical issues. Throughout the flight the bus voltage will come down. After landing and taxiing in the voltage climbs back up, and rests around 13.8. Recently after takeoff, the low voltage alarm flashed and went to 10.8 while raising the gear. The hosts think it’s a voltage regulator issue, where it works when cold but not warm. Paul said he thinks of voltage as an indicator of whether the system is working and the amps as an indicator of how hard it’s working. It should be around 13.8 or 14 when working properly. Colleen said she had an electrical issue where her JPI would go offline when she would cycle the gear. Under the panel she found that there was a loose connection on the shunt, causing high resistance. Jason’s issue could be at the circuit breakers, voltage bus, voltage regulator, or any number of places. One way to easily troubleshoot is to see if he can find anything hot by running his hands along the wires. Or look for discoloration, Paul said.   Steve writes in asking about oil coolers. During his recent engine overhaul the shop asked if he wanted a congealing or non-congealing oil cooler. Congealing is bad, he thought, so he elected to go with non-congealing. But he lives in Arizona and he’s found the engine runs a bit hotter with a higher oil temperature in long climbs. He’s wondering if he made a mistake. Non-congealing oil coolers have a solid line running through the middle that passes warm oil through the cooler at all times. Mike thinks it’s possible the non-congealing has less cooling capacity because it has less surface area.

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  54:31
• "Shame on you for even thinking about it"

  Should you trade your aging airplane in anticipation of higher repair costs on your current bird? Mike, Paul, and Colleen have a strong opinion on this. Plus, sticky valves, taking good care of turbos, and engine monitor set-up frustrations. Email [email protected] for a chance to be on the show. Join the world's largest aviation community at aopa.org/join Full notes below: Scott has a Tecnam P2010 with a Lycoming IO-390. He’s had a few instances where cylinders dropped off, the engine ran rough, and then they quickly came back on. It was followed by morning sickness. In essence he had a sticky valve. He found that his CHT temperatures were quite low. At altitude, running the airplane at best cruise power, his CHTs are about 350 degrees. In climb if he leans he can get three cylinders over 350. Mike said he wouldn’t stress about the CHTs, but he would borescope the cylinders to verify that there isn’t too much build-up.   Yuriy has a new-to-him 2010 Cirrus SR22 that’s turbonormalized and he’s looking for some tips on taking care of his turbos. He flies lean of peak at 28 inches. He is limiting turbine inlet temperatures at 1,500 degrees. Mike thinks 1,500 is excessively conservative. The red line is 1,650 degrees, and Mike tries to keep his at or below 1,600 degrees. He also doesn’t subscribe to the one inch per minute reduction of manifold pressure. Lycoming at one time published a document that said not to cool CHT more than 60 degrees a minute. Mike’s engine monitor alarm is at 30 degrees a minute, and he said it doesn’t go off very often. He also doesn’t cool the turbo on the ground before shutting down unless he had high power right before landing for some reason.   Wade has a Cessna 185 with an IO-550. On his last annual he had a few burned exhaust valves. He’s trying to avoid higher maintenance bills in the future. Paul tries to make Wade feel better by telling him that burned valves have nothing to do with how he’s operating the engine and everything to do with the lead in avgas. Going through his operating technique, the only suggestion they have is for Wade to lean much faster, and avoid using the lean find feature. The green arc on his manifold pressure gauge is also wrong. He was worried that he’d have to take off at partial power in order to stay in the green arc on the gauge. The hosts discuss how to reprogram the display.   Matt doesn’t want to throw good money after bad. He’s wondering how long you should hang on to an airplane as it ages. He has a 1977 Cessna T210. Parts are starting to get scarce. It’s hard to find qualified mechanics. He feels like he wants a great airplane that lasts him well into the future. The hosts all agree that it’s better to hold on to the airplane he knows, and not to worry about 210 parts availability, at least when compared to other airplanes.

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  57:33
• "If that doesn't work you've got the flame thrower option"

  Ever wonder how the flap system in a Cessna works? This episode Mike, Paul, and Colleen take a deep dive on the system, plus engine vibrations, leaning for high altitude takeoffs and go arounds, and getting bees out of a restoration. Email [email protected] for a chance to be on the show. Join the world's largest aviation community at aopa.org/join Full notes below: Ken is experiencing vibrations in his Cherokee at certain throttle settings. After installing an engine monitor he discovered that with the throttle at roughly 90 percent full he could induce the vibration, but then quell it by using the mixture. He could see that a cylinder was going offline at full rich, but came back online when leaned. Mike suggests that he needs to lean in the climb to compensate for the overly rich mixture, but Ken said he’s also able to stop the vibration by reducing the throttle setting but keeping the mixture full rich. The hosts still think he’s too rich. They recommend leaning in the climb and keeping the EGT constant as he climbs. Ken also noticed that the cylinder that goes offline is also an outlier on the engine monitor. They tell him to do a GAMI lean test and an induction leak test to try and isolate whether he has a problem or just a poor mixture distribution. Find the test Mike described on Youtube: https://youtu.be/_VfiPuheeGw For more on the induction leak test Paul described: https://www.savvyaviation.com/wp-content/uploads/savvy_pdf/Savvy-Flight-Test-Profile-Expanded.pdf Marcus has a first generation Cirrus and he wants to ensure he is leaning properly for high-altitude takeoffs. Paul said to put his EGT around 1,300 or 1,350 degrees, which will put him close to the Cirrus chart, but is more accurate. For high altitude go arounds, Paul knows his fuel flow at around 1,300 degrees EGT, so he just sets the fuel flow to the expected amount. Luke has been having an issue with the flaps coming down in his 182. What follows is a loooooonnng and detailed description of the Cessna flap system. Blythe was restoring his family’s Cessna 150 and found a bunch of mud daubers. The inspection panels allowed him to clean out some, but he assumes there are more that he couldn’t reach. Paul said the potential corrosion is a key to the solution. He said the bees don’t like to build nests on corrosion inhibitors. He also said to make sure to check up the vertical stabilizer, which is a popular spot. Mike said he’s had luck with moth balls in other machinery.

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  1:05:24
• "Your airplane is on a full-time IV drip"

  Can one high oil pressure reading forever alter your engine? Mike, Paul, and Colleen answer this question, plus the quirks of the O-470, compression test redemption, and repairman certificates. Email [email protected] for a chance to be on the show. Join the world's largest aviation community at aopa.org/join Full notes below: Everett is wondering if his oil pressure is forever altered. He has a Piper Colt with an O-235. The pressure used to be 75 psi, and on a flight the oil temp spiked and the pressured went up to 85 psi. Even after cylinder work, the temperature and pressure have remained high. Paul starts by asking if he’s sure the indications are correct. They suspect a blockage somewhere, although there’s no oil cooler on the O-235. They suggest getting a manual to check for the engine’s entire oil pathway and follow it to see if he can find a blockage. Randall wants to know if the hosts are too hard on compression tests. He asks whether they hold any value. Mike said there’s no harm in doing compression tests, but that one should never change or overhaul a cylinder with compression numbers alone. Knowing where the air is escaping does offer some value, they say. There’s not much you can discover on a compression test that you wouldn’t discover on a borescope inspection that impacts safety of flight, Paul said. Manuel asks how EGT and fuel flow relate on his Cessna 180. He’s seeing a spike in EGTs before they come down again on takeoff. The low compression O-470 will have higher EGTs, especially on takeoff. Mike said Manuel's engine monitor is configured for a carbureted engine, and thus puts a big time delay and smoothing function on the fuel flow. Without the smoothing, the fuel flow would wobble up and down often, making it hard to read. That’s why fuel flow indications rise so slowly after adding takeoff power. And bu slowly adding power, Manuel is delaying the addition of the enrichment function of the carb, which is why he’s seeing a delay for the EGTs coming down. Marty is trying to understand repairman certification limitations. He’s done some work on his prop, magnetos, and so on, and he wants to make sure it’s all been legal. Mike said as he understands it, you basically have unlimited authority to do what you want on your airplane. The common sense rule applies, which is to get a demo or some instruction before you do it for the first time.

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  1:08:56

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